Horrible experience with orthodontists in Bangkok

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krystal7krystal7
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2017 10:34 am

Horrible experience with orthodontists in Bangkok

#1 Postby krystal7krystal7 » Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:25 am

Wanted to share my (very) long bad experiences with my different orthodontists in Bangkok.

My problem is center tooth's anterior cross-bite and overbite.
I didn't know anything about braces, didn't even know I had an over-bite. I asked my friend who had braces & she only said "just do it, it will be fine".

With my first orthodontist, I just said "Can you fix my teeth ?". He looked at it and said yes, and i said lets do it. I didn't know what kind of procedures there would be nor problems I might have. Nurses first cleansed my teeth but she was so rough. There was some water in my mouth too (couldn't breathe) I raised my hand 2 times but she didn't stop doing it. I ended up coughing, so she stopped & lectured me that I should not move like that & should raise my hand if I wanted something. (I raised my hand twice !). She laughed & said "Just be patient" when i said it hurt. While i was getting my braces, she had this suction tool to suck saliva but she pushed it too hard under my tongue that it was sucking the skin instead. I had the bruise for a week. Well, that’s that.

So back to my orthodontist, he put some blue composite on one molar from each sides. I came back & noticed only on next day that my left upper tooth (2nd premolar) was hitting the bottom bracket due to over-bite. The upper tooth hit the bracket before any other teeth can touch the bottom. I called the hospital letting them know about it but
Nurses : "It is supposed to be that way. The blue buildups are supposed to make a gap. As long as the molars touch the bottom, there is no problem".
Me : "No, the blue buildups are too thin that it's doing nothing. The upper tooth hit the bracket before the blue buildups can touch the bottom. So, molars don't touch. The tooth hitting bracket is causing THE gap, not the buildups".
Nurses : "That's how it is supposed to be ! Just be patient & it’s ok as long as you don’t chew things like bones". (They just said "it is normal as long as molars touch" but this is also normal now)

I went to the hospital again, my orthodontist wasn't there but a female orthodontist & 3 nurses were there saying that my tooth hitting the bottom bracket is perfectly normal. They laughed at me like I said something extremely stupid. I insisted that I wanted my buildups just a little bit higher. I mean, he did put the buildups but it was only too thin, so why couldn't they make it just a bit higher ?

Ortho and nurses : "No it will cause an open-bite. We can't make it any higher"
Me : "I don't mind having an open-bite. It's fine. I just don't want to chew between one tooth & the bracket"
Ortho & nurses : "No it will cause open-bite. You have to wait a few months. The wires will move your teeth and it will be better /gave me a mirror/ see this wire ? It will change your teeth" (hey, I do know what wires are for without having them to tell me #_#)
Me : "Then, over bite is causing this. So how is over bite going to be corrected ?"
Ortho : "Do you see the wire ? Your teeth will move". (I was expecting something like Expander as my lower teeth are narrow. Not right away of course but wanted to know the procedures in the future generally)

So repeating same conversation for a few more times, I couldn't win 1 vs 4 & came back without buildups. At home, I texted my first orthodontist about it & he also had the same answer.

Day 7, my center tooth (cross-bite) started to move but the bottom tooth was in the way stopping it. I could feel the upper tooth pushing the bottom tooth. Day 7 photo - http://i1146.photobucket.com/albums/o52 ... mshuhr.png

Day 14, they collided very hard as the upper tooth moved more and more forward. I couldn't close my mouth at all. I couldn't sleep or talk. I had to bite my tongue between molars to do the work instead of blue buildups. But I couldn't do it for hours, I have to talk & eat too. I couldn't do it at all when i sleep. The pain from colliding woke me up every 5 mins. It was like knocking my tooth out. Kept texting my ortho for 2 days, taking pictures that I need an open bite to fix cross-bite. But he insisted that i didn't need to.

Me : "How are you going to fix anterior cross-bite without an open-bite ?
Ortho : "I want you to be patient. They will change into a better position over months & you will feel better. You have to be patient. Do you see the wires ? They will change your teeth's position".

But it doesn't make sense to me. My tooth need some space to come out but my bottom was in the way. I even drew a picture to explain that. I even sent him the videos I found on youtube correcting anterior crossbite with buildups & open bite.

After a very long repeated conversation,
Ortho : "I still suggest not to do it but if you want it so much. You can come. But you should be patient. If you can't eat because they collide, move your jaw out (forward) a little bit to the position that they wouldn't collide".

THE HECK ???!!!!!! Move my jaw out ? Of course i could do it for a few minutes but what about when I sleep ? I couldn't believe he asked me to do it. I felt like I couldn’t trust him anymore, like he didn’t know how to fix my teeth or in a better way.

So, Day 17, my 2nd ortho agreed to give me higher buildups as soon as she saw my mouth. I was glad... but for 1 sec. She started saying my jaw is slightly tilted which we never noticed, I heard that for the first time in my entire life.
2nd ortho : "I can fix your teeth. But, will you really be happy just by fixing your teeth ? Are you sure that is all you want ? Noo...Not pretty. Bottom half of your face, ugly ! I can do a jaw surgery for you. It is your choice. You can decide. But think about it until next month".

I was not interested at all but I listened what she wanted to say anyways. She talked about the ugliness for 10 mins before she finally got my buildups & she was still talking while roughly putting on the blue composite on 4 teeth each side. She was busy talking to my mom convincing to let me have a jaw surgery that the blue composites were all over my gums. Then she had to trim to get have a better/even bite, she was STILL glancing at my mom talking how ugly my jaw was that she accidentally cut my inside cheek with the trimming tool and there was a lot of blood. But she acted like nothing happened & kept talking, my translator had to point it out. She said "Oh just a little bit of blood, it's fine". In the end, the buildups were still uneven with lots of excess, overflowing on gums, very sharp & pointy poking my tongue but I didn't dare to ask her to trim more. I wish I had my camera with me to show that.

So, for 3rd ortho, my dad asked his friend whose daughter also had braces. We decided to go to the same ortho as he strongly recommended. It is simitawe or samitivej hospital, and my third ortho agreed to continue my treatment. He first had to redo my buildups. Got buildups on 2 molars each side. But it was uneven & had to fix again & again (which is totally normal). But he was impatient & he decided to only match 1 molar on each side. (Only one buildup of side was high enough) which I didn't complain at all & left. (I didn't want more problems. I decided to be patient as long as there wasn't a big problem). But i did have a hard time chewing with only one molar. Without even chewing, pressure on just my back molars still cause sore, let alone chewing. I lost about 8 pounds which I’m not really happy with as I was already underweight before this. Some say it gets better over time but not for me after 2 months, I still get headache from it. I started grinding my teeth in my sleep & I knew it because I woke up from the pain sometimes.

After a month, I went back for follow up adjustment on Sunday which was yesterday. Now there's no cross-bite anymore. Yayy !

Day 13 & 47 Comparison - http://i1146.photobucket.com/albums/o52 ... djudjv.png

At first, he was putting this new wire into my mouth, but one end of the wire didn't go into my mouth & poked my face instead (it hurts of course as he was pushing the other end to the back molars) that I suddenly raised my hand as startled. My hand happened to touch the wire which I didn't mean to at all, I was only trying to raise my hand but I couldn't see anything with the green cloth (with a just hole for my mouth) on my face so, that happened. And he couldn't stop talking about it for a good 2 mins, the nurse even held my hands, he thought i did it on purpose. I couldn't talk with his hands in my mouth so I just had to listen to his lecture how I should be patient while lying there as the teeth treatment thing is complicated.

As in photos, there's no cross-bite anymore so I figured he might lower my buildups a little bit (so that I could eat better & feel better too). But after changing wires, he didn't do anything else.

Me : "Can't you lower my buildups a little bit ? My tooth is not trapped behind or collides anymore"
3rd ortho : "No, we will remove them 2 months later. Your teeth need to move more" (Which I have also read that buildups help teeth to move faster so I don't disagree)
Me : "How about lowering it just a little~~~~ bit ? I want to eat a bit more comfortably".
3rd ortho : "Ok but just little bit ! We shouldn't lower it too much".

Of course I didn't want to lower it too much either as I know upper teeth will hit the bottom brackets.

Then he started trimming it one time & it was still uneven of course.
Ortho : "ok ?"
Me : "My right molars touch the bottom but left don't".

So, he trimmed my right buildups to even it out. *But he trimmed it like.. too long ? He trimmed a lot* He should have just trimmed it 1 or 2 sec. 1 sec sounds short but it is actually just a tiny bit of unevenness, yet he did it too much that it was uneven again.

Me : "Now my right molars don't touch the bottom when the left do".

But then he was like.. he had this impatient expression !

(WHY ? It is *normal* to take a few tries to fix the uneven the bite !! I have been to dentists a lot, unaccountably when I was young. I didn't take care of my teeth as a kid so, lots of cavities all over which means I needed fillings & it always takes 3 to 10 times to trim the high fillings until it is not uneven anymore because biting on a “high” filling or crown can cause the tooth to become tender or sore. Dentists always trim it a little bit & asked me to bite on something like paper to check the bite. Then trimming again & biting again, it repeats until the patient says "ok". It always takes some time. Sometimes it even takes another visit util it is perfect. Who had cavities would know this).

And he started trimming again but he trimmed the right side !! He should be doing the opposite side, as the right is the side that doesn't touch the bottom. The left buildup was higher, he should trim the left. Even my mom was saying "the opposite side !". Or he should put more buildups on right side (that's because he trimmed it too much in the first place).

Then he asked "ok now ?"
Me : "No my right doesn't touch the bottom. My right. This side. Right side is the side that doesn't touch the bottom".

He became rougher while trimming it, obvious that he was so impatient.
Ortho : "Ok now ?".
Me : (I'm frustrated too now that he doesn't pay attention which side he should be trimming & doing it on the wrong side) I sighed* "No my right side is the side that has a gap ! This right side. Has a gap. This side doesn't touch the bottom! Left side buildups are high that right side doesn't touch the bottom!"
(I also show him with hand gestures all to make him understand).
But he looked so... impatient with dark expression, frowning at me. Said ok ok & he placed the green cloth on my face very roughly that my jaw got into the hole but he started trimming just like that I had to move the cloth like 2 times, he was acting so impatient.

He trimmed it again (trimmed a lot as always) but AGAIN on the right side !!! Ughh..
My mom was also saying repeatedly "it is the opposite side ! opposite side ! Wrong side!".

I complained OF COURSE that he is doing the wrong side making it more uneven, explaining again, point at my teeth which side is not touching the bottom. Then, he roughly got rid of all the buildups *WITHOUT* even asking me. He might have even trimmed my teeth a bit, I can feel it with my tongue that it's too curved inwards like a cavity. I thought he was trying to redo it from the start by removing all of it. But no, he was like "no buildups now. Not uneven anymore right ?". Like he didn't want to do this anymore.

So, with no buildups, my left upper molars hit the bottom brackets (which right molars still don't touch the bottom). I told him to put the buildups again as I would probably bite off my brackets while eating.

Ortho : "You don't need buildups anymore. Your front tooth is now not trapped behind. You don't need it". (Yeah ? He said i need them till 2 months later just a few minutes ago ?)

Me : "But I want to chew a little bit. Now none of my teeth touches the bottom. Only teeth to brackets. Shouldn't there be a little bit of buildups ?"

Ortho : "No. Your teeth are so short. The buildups will prevent them to grow longer. It should be natural (? something like that) No buildups will help your teeth grow longer natural"
(Ok so, he at first told me to remove them 2 months later. Now, just because he is impatient to even my bite, suddenly "natural has to be it"?).
Me : "I think the brackets will come off"
Ortho : "Eat chicken, eat rice, eat whatever you want, it will not come off. It would never happen". (My friend, who had no problem with her bite, had her bracket broken while she was eating)

My dad's friend (who recommended this doctor) came in suddenly (late) and he took the doctor's side as he didn't know what happened before he came.

At that point, i was so tired & hungry & sick of arguing with orthos & I just wanted to end it nicely but everything had to go wrong.

He started drawing a picture, trying to explain his excuse of "natural with no buildups". I felt like he started drawing only to show my dad’s friend to prove that he was right & I was wrong. I didn't feel like listening to him anymore, I mean.. at first he said "i will remove the buildups 2 months later" but suddenly extremely serious about "Natural" with no buildups just because he was so impatient to trim a little bit.

I was a bit teary (so upset with this whole thing since Day1) & turned to take a tissue but he started saying "see..?? see ??! she doesn't listen !! She has to listen but she doesn't !!" together with hand gestures like I am *the problem. I told him "I already understand what you said" (the excuse of "natural").
then he started yelling "YOU ONLY UNDERSTAND YOUUUUU" pointing his finger at my face like 5 inches away !! The heck ??? Of course I understand me the most & that's why HE NEEDS to listen to me first. He was only impatient & suddenly came up with "natural, no buildup" thing later. It's so obvious & he is the one who trimmed the wrong* side for 3 times* as he never listened to me but he yelled at me "listen to meeee" instead.

He is not completely wrong about my short teeth, I know it’s true but.. he went from "Remove 2 months later" > "Lower only a little bit" > "Must not have buildups ! Natural ! Your short teeth need to grow longer" within a few minutes *just because* he was impatient to trimming the buildups so I simply couldn't pretend listening. I simply didn't want to leave with uneven bite with uneven buildups but in the end he had to ask me to leave chewing on my brackets on just one side.

People tell me that I must not change my ortho no matter what. Of course I didn't want to change too, I really don't. But now I’m tired of everything & I really regret getting braces :( So, that's my story..

Ps. Please don't laugh at my grammar mistakes :'( English is not my first language

claribeary
Posts: 27
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2017 3:27 am

Re: Horrible experience with orthodontists

#2 Postby claribeary » Tue Jun 20, 2017 1:10 am

Hi Krystal,

I'm so so sorry to read of your horrifying experience with 3 different orthodontists. I was mildly horrified that all 3 have treated you like this. It sounds like it's either a running culture with orthos in Bangkok, or something else is the issue here. Of course, all i have to go on here is what you've written, but from what i've read it really seems like you should look for another ortho who actually listens to you and doesn't treat you like a petulant child. You mentioned your parents accompanying you on your appointments which makes me think you're pretty young. This may be one reason why they're treating you like that. The ortho shouting at you is also ??? really unprofessional. Goodness me.

Your teeth should NOT be knocking into the brackets. Blimey. That's the reason they invented molar buildups and any proper ortho would be equipped to install them correctly. It's downright impossible to get the height right with one try, which is why (in my experience) dentists put this red paper thing and get you to bite down to see if the bite is right. My ortho did this when installing my buildups too and i haven't had any issues with them at all. When i got a filling done I kept saying my bite was off and they repeated the process with the red paper like 8 times before i was happy. They shouldn't stop until you tell them it feels natural.

FInd a new ortho if you can, darling. Hope it all gets better for you! :rose:
Image

krystal7krystal7
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2017 10:34 am

Re: Horrible experience with orthodontists

#3 Postby krystal7krystal7 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 3:59 am

Hi, claribeary !

I really wanted to confide in although it was very long. So, thanks a lot for reading & for your kind reply :D

The last ortho was so unprofessional & the rudest person I have ever seen :( I still can't understand how he became a doctor when he is extremely impatient, not wanting to listen anything, getting angry to spend a few more minutes to fix a simple problem every visit.

Oh, my mom came with me to make payments, I'm 22 but still a student.

And for update, I did find a new orthodontist ! He listened to me very patiently and explained everything. Very gentle and always asks my opinion. He patiently cut the wires about 10 times each to make sure they were the exact fit. During the discussion, he took a lot of pauses/time just to let me take time if I might think of more questions to ask. He is totally ***opposite*** to the previous ones. I wish everyone could be kind like him.


[quote="claribeary"]Hi Krystal,

I'm so so sorry to read of your horrifying experience with 3 different orthodontists. I was mildly horrified that all 3 have treated you like this. It sounds like it's either a running culture with orthos in Bangkok, or something else is the issue here. Of course, all i have to go on here is what you've written, but from what i've read it really seems like you should look for another ortho who actually listens to you and doesn't treat you like a petulant child. You mentioned your parents accompanying you on your appointments which makes me think you're pretty young. This may be one reason why they're treating you like that. The ortho shouting at you is also ??? really unprofessional. Goodness me.

Your teeth should NOT be knocking into the brackets. Blimey. That's the reason they invented molar buildups and any proper ortho would be equipped to install them correctly. It's downright impossible to get the height right with one try, which is why (in my experience) dentists put this red paper thing and get you to bite down to see if the bite is right. My ortho did this when installing my buildups too and i haven't had any issues with them at all. When i got a filling done I kept saying my bite was off and they repeated the process with the red paper like 8 times before i was happy. They shouldn't stop until you tell them it feels natural.

FInd a new ortho if you can, darling. Hope it all gets better for you! :rose:[/quote]

fayth
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:23 am

Re: Horrible experience with orthodontists in Bangkok

#4 Postby fayth » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:53 am

Oh no that sounds terrible, I'd be really upset if I were in your position! Are you going to visit another orthodontist?
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