Going behind my ortho's back?

Message

#1 Post by **alyssabunny** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 12:13 pm

Hi,

I was hoping you could help me. I opted to have my dentist do my braces but I am 15 months into treatment and not happy with my results. My previous dentist had recommended a surgical consult so I am really surprised that this dentist said I didnt need it. But he keeps talking about the limitations, i.e. he cant fix my overbite, I will need crowns to support my back teeth. As is stands right now, I still have crossbites in two places that he cant fix. I am disappointed with the compromises and I am not happy with the results so far so I have made an appointment for a surgical consult.

I was wondering how I should go about telling him since I have two months before my surgical consult. I dont want to find another ortho this far into treatment since I have paid most of my bill already, but at the same time, I am upset that he hasnt accepted that his proposed treatment plan isnt working. I dont want to offend him, but I want a stable result and I dont think it is possible at this point without surgery.

Any suggestions?

Thanks,

Alyssa

#2 Post by **Flora2006** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:55 pm

Alyssa, is he an actual orthodontist or a dentist who does some orthodontic work? If he is just a dentist, I really think you should go see an ortho...Otherwise, you really need to have a talk with him. You are paying a lot of money for this and you are suppose to be satisfied. I kind of can't believe that he can't fix your overbite...I've heard that crossbites may be hard to fix sometimes but still...have a talk with him.

Good luck and keep us posted!

#3 Post by **paw655** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 5:45 pm

Alyssa,

If you have the time before the consult, you might want to schedule a consult with your ortho. Come in with a list of what your concerns are, but DO NOT mention the surgical consult. That will be a threat to him and rock the boat.

As you go through your list, ask him to how he will address your concerns. If he keeps saying he can't, he can't, then turn the table on him and say "well, these are areas of concern I would like fixed, what do you recommend if you cannot fix them." Hopefully, that will corner him into a surgical consult, or make him commit to how he proposes you get satisfaction from treatment.

Even if he does not suggest the surgical consult, see what he suggests. Also, ask for his responses to your concerns in writing, just casually, "to help you remember". This may be necessary down the road if there is an issue of non-performance and money.

Once you have a feel for his ideas, I'd try to get a consult sooner at another doctor. Even if it is not who you plan to go with permanently, you need to get some input sooner than 2 months from now.

Keep us posted.

Allison

#4 Post by **dr.j** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 5:10 am

If I can be so bold I would not recommend "cornering" an orthodontist and "turning any tables on him/her" with respect to revealing the whole story. All of the time we fail to get all of the information we need as medical professionals due to "withholding" of information. Go see an RO: "Real Orthodontist!" and tell him everything that bothers you and ask for your options. If you do not like what you hear, go see another one.

For my education: what makes one seek treatment with a GP and not an orthodontist? loyalty/trust?, price?, you were misled into believing he could "fix" it? were you informed he had some limited training?

As an orthodontist I would like to know so I can find what makes people seek treatment as they do.

#5 Post by **paw655** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 6:05 am

Dr. J-

Because I can only speak for myself, I will keep this in the first person:

With all due respect, please focus on the content of my posts and not the process. In other words, please focus on the subject matter and not the picayune emotions or other underlying messages.

Thank you.

Allison

#6 Post by **momof2grlz** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 5:35 pm

paw655 wrote:Dr. J-

Because I can only speak for myself, I will keep this in the first person:

With all due respect, please focus on the content of my posts and not the process. In other words, please focus on the subject matter and not the picayune emotions or other underlying messages.

Thank you.

Allison

You know, Dr. J and Dr. Randall haven't been able to post very much lately. I'm sure they're busy with their practices and come to this board as a COURTESY to its users. Your post says "with all due respect". Frankly, I find your post to Dr. J very DISRESPECTFUL. He has just as much right to ask questions of posters as we do to ask questions of him. Rather than chase him away with your nastiness, you might want to thank him for his help with this board.

Thank you Docs for the time that you are able to devote to the board. Most posters sincerely appreciate it!

Chris

#7 Post by **paw655** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 6:51 pm

Momof...

1. I am the first to compliment people and praise when appropriate. However, I have been on this site since Feb. 27 and seen a grand total of two posts by a DDS-one clarifying the difference between two ortho groups, and this one.

If I saw that Dr. J had done any work for this board, I would thank him. Bear in mind, ma'am, that I can only make an assessment on what I have seen and/or experienced. What I have seen is a master screen where two orthos get incredible advertising, paid or not I don't know, and they haven't done what the forum says they do. It's great they are busy, but if they don't have the time for this, maybe Lynn needs to find other orthos to work with. I don't hold it against them, but I do wonder what the standard is. It is clear when you read the Ask the Docs threads, new people are really looking for help, and aren't getting it. Maybe the longer people are around they know what to expect, but that hurts the credibility of the whole site.

2. I am not sure if you followed my point to DrJ. I was referencing his taking my language out of context from a completely different post and using it in a rather condescending manner. I have no problems with him asking questions, and never said I did.

He was patently disrespectful to me in how he misconstrued my words, but I guess since I do not have a DDS and am not an ortho it is OK for him to be quite rude to me and I should just be a doormat. Orthos are not gods, they are people, just like the rest of us, and if they are rude or abusive, we have the right to say something.

Also, isn't DrJ. able to fight his own battles? If he has a problem with me or my posts, he should communicate with me directly, or at worst, with Lynn.

#8 Post by **dr.j** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 4:53 am

Folks:
I seemed to have created a firestorm of contraversy and man that's not what was intended. I must say that Dr. Randall (whom I've never met) and I are absolutely not receiving any marketing adavantage at all from trying to help people on this web site! I am a solo practitioner in "Podunk" South Carolina, not a nationally syndicated orthodontic franchise - I am not going to get patient one from having my name on anything. In fact, I can remove my name from this site and change it to Dr. X from Sheboygan, WI if it would help anyone know that !!!

Any doctor that purveys this aweseome website does so b/c they love orthodontics. I really - selfishly - do it for me. I like to know what our patients are thinking and not saying, so that I may better serve them.
I think I have posted over 250 replies so far!
You may not see a doctor post for a while for many reasons.
1) we are not paid to do this we do it when we can
2) we all have families (kids) at home - right now it's Sunday before church and I'm trying to get food into my child (ugh!) while I also try to answer web questions!!!
3) sometimes our practices are busy
4) sometimes the topics are better than others
No offense, but I tend not to go into a topic called "blue ligs vs. gray ligs!!!". I have tended to lean towards answering questions that interest me and look like the poster has given enough background to really give a good response. Most of my posts are in respone to ortho mechanics: bite leveling, space closure, etc.
So if someone is offended b/c I gave just as honest an opinion as someone who posted sorry to have ruffled your feathers. Now lets move on and enjoy the beautiful world outside!!!!

#9 Post by **dr.j** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 5:05 am

I just re-read my original post and I saw nothing rude, offensive or anything like that. I will concede that reading something, one can pull out a tone in the text that is wholey unintended. I've done that before (but I did not blast anyone!).
My questions about why a GP and not an ortho where just questions. If you met me, you might quickly find I am the last thing on earth with a God complex. (That's almost funny: I'm 5'9'', 155 lbs, I look like the kid from "Blues Clues", I listen to Hall and Oates, I can still quote every line from Star Wars, and my teen patients call me "Nerd" to my face!) and I treat everyone I meet with respect. I'm sorry that someone has made you feel this way toward dentists/orthodontists. Hopefully Archwired.com can help folks feel otherwise.

I'll try to post more.

#10 Post by **momof2grlz** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 6:53 am

paw655 wrote:Momof...

1. I am the first to compliment people and praise when appropriate. However, I have been on this site since Feb. 27 and seen a grand total of two posts by a DDS-one clarifying the difference between two ortho groups, and this one.

If I saw that Dr. J had done any work for this board, I would thank him. Bear in mind, ma'am, that I can only make an assessment on what I have seen and/or experienced. What I have seen is a master screen where two orthos get incredible advertising, paid or not I don't know, and they haven't done what the forum says they do. It's great they are busy, but if they don't have the time for this, maybe Lynn needs to find other orthos to work with

Since you've been a member of the board for all of a month, I guess that makes you an expert on how it should be run. I think Lynn will tell you that, unfortunately, she doesn't have a waiting list of orthos who are anxious to contribute to this board on a regular basis. Perhaps your ortho would like to become a contributor? With your pleasant, endearing, non-confrontational personality, I'm sure you could convince him to answer questions on the board free-of-charge in his limitless spare time.

My original post still stands. Dr. J disagreed with your suggested approach to the original poster's query. Your response to him was unnecessarily rude.

Chris

#11 Post by **JumpTheDitch** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 7:24 am

Paw655 -> please see my post in Ev's Mom's "Experts" thread.

I really can't believe you were so rude to Dr J.

I really can't believe you're being so rude to so many people on this board. I am struggling to understand why.

Each time I click into a new thread lately I find yet another negative, confrontational post from you.

Please stop sullying our supportive forum with your negativity. Everyone here is being supportive and positive to all other posters. You might have noticed that if you weren't so busy criticising. The Dr's do what they can, which is more helpful than constant criticism. Please desist.

#12 Post by **paw655** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 3:59 pm

So I post something negative. Big deal.
So I post something positive. Big deal.

There are an awful lot of young people who post here who do deserve to hear both sides of the ortho story....some are great, but when you're not sure you're happy, it's OK to speak up. I think that is a very valuable lesson for the younger generation to learn.

Anyway, if you don't like my post, and it is not directed at you or hurtful towards you, let it go...

#13 Post by **jcdamon3** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 4:41 pm

paw655:

The problem now is that your posts are hurting others on this board. Dr. J has not come to this board in awhile. We all appreciate it when he does. He has politely and promptly answered some of my questions previously and I appreciate it. Instead of helping others right now he is wasting his precious time dealing with you!

I think it would be appropriate if you made an apology.

Dislaimer:

This post is my own thoughts and feelings. I am entitled to them. They are not necessarily the thoughts and feelings of anyone else on this board, the administrator or Dr. J.

Thanks.

PS. You are not just negative. You are downright contrary. You seem to pick the opposite opinion whenver you can.

#14 Post by **paw655** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 8:03 pm

Please explain how my posts can hurt anyone.

You seem to be giving me way more power than I have.

#15 Post by **sweetgurl** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 9:36 pm

paw, i think you should say sorry to Dr.J. Think about what u said and not be any more aggressive. Dr. J. reply one of my question and i thank him for that.
Keep up the good work Dr J. and don't let such a little thing keep you from posting.