Terrible results and nerve damage

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devastated
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Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:40 pm

Terrible results and nerve damage

#1 Postby devastated » Mon Mar 27, 2017 10:05 am

Ive posted here before on how bad my aesthetic results are. Unfortunatelly they got even worse as swelling went down (4th month now) but its not all. My motor nerve (eye and mouth branch) as well as lingual nerve got injured/damaged - dont know. Experiencing constant tongue burning. Lips assymetry (EMG confirmed facial nerve 7 injury)
I did the surgery for easthetic reasins to fix problems after extractions / orthodontics.
Now my face looks horrible (long, cheeks dropped, upper lip dalling over teeth, chin crooked, lips crooked due to nerve injury) I cannot believe this actually is happening. Im going from not believing to hoping Ill wake up from this nightmare to suicidal thoughts. I searched threw forum and havent found anyone w nerves damage? I dont know what to do and where to start. My doctor says to wait but what for? I was social happy person running my business and politically active. Im now locked in a house fighting every minute to stay somewhat calm. I guess I wanted to share it for others to take under consideration before undergoing this surgery - that anything can happen. My surgeon is regarded one of the best in my country.

snapdresser
Posts: 749
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 7:31 am

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#2 Postby snapdresser » Mon Mar 27, 2017 10:26 am

Back in January you were talking about getting a lot of additional work done. Did you do that? Are you still taking the antidepressants?
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devastated
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:40 pm

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#3 Postby devastated » Mon Mar 27, 2017 10:41 am

No I havent done anything. Back then I believed I only had problems with aesthetic. If that was the case Id probably have the strenght to cruise tvrew doctors and search for solutions. With nerve damage - theres not much you can do (apparently) I was told its prob due to swelling and will resolve. I read most resolve in 8 wks so I relaxed but by month 4 when theres no improvement but new symptoms - I just lost hope. Cannot chew food without openong mouth. My lips and nose is crooked (nerve damage) I lisp a bit and my tongue is burning (i suspect also feom nerve damage) so aesthetics although theyre also distressing - are not sth I can cope with now. Thank you for replying and asking.

devastated
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:40 pm

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#4 Postby devastated » Mon Mar 27, 2017 10:51 am

snapdresser wrote:Back in January you were talking about getting a lot of additional work done. Did you do that? Are you still taking the antidepressants?


Ps. Im not taking antidepressants any more. To be honest I cant even schedule an appointment with doctor.. I know I should But then I feel hopeless and dont do a thing.

snapdresser
Posts: 749
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 7:31 am

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#5 Postby snapdresser » Mon Mar 27, 2017 11:25 am

devastated wrote:No I havent done anything. Back then I believed I only had problems with aesthetic. If that was the case Id probably have the strenght to cruise tvrew doctors and search for solutions. With nerve damage - theres not much you can do (apparently) I was told its prob due to swelling and will resolve. I read most resolve in 8 wks so I relaxed but by month 4 when theres no improvement but new symptoms - I just lost hope. Cannot chew food without openong mouth. My lips and nose is crooked (nerve damage) I lisp a bit and my tongue is burning (i suspect also feom nerve damage) so aesthetics although theyre also distressing - are not sth I can cope with now. Thank you for replying and asking.


I know it may sound counterintuitive, but I think the burning sensation on your tongue is probably a good thing. As the nerves regenerate (it can take a year or more) these unusual sensations will come and go, but it ultimately means that sensation isn't lost. Are there any parts of your lips/chin/etc. that you have absolutely no sensation, even when poked with a toothpick or something sharp?

I think you should definitely meet with a doctor to at least get the suicidal thoughts treated. The mental aspects of this surgery are really tough as it is.
No braces
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devastated
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:40 pm

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#6 Postby devastated » Mon Mar 27, 2017 11:44 am

snapdresser wrote:
devastated wrote:No I havent done anything. Back then I believed I only had problems with aesthetic. If that was the case Id probably have the strenght to cruise tvrew doctors and search for solutions. With nerve damage - theres not much you can do (apparently) I was told its prob due to swelling and will resolve. I read most resolve in 8 wks so I relaxed but by month 4 when theres no improvement but new symptoms - I just lost hope. Cannot chew food without openong mouth. My lips and nose is crooked (nerve damage) I lisp a bit and my tongue is burning (i suspect also feom nerve damage) so aesthetics although theyre also distressing - are not sth I can cope with now. Thank you for replying and asking.


I know it may sound counterintuitive, but I think the burning sensation on your tongue is probably a good thing. As the nerves regenerate (it can take a year or more) these unusual sensations will come and go, but it ultimately means that sensation isn't lost. Are there any parts of your lips/chin/etc. that you have absolutely no sensation, even when poked with a toothpick or something sharp?

I think you should definitely meet with a doctor to at least get the suicidal thoughts treated. The mental aspects of this surgery are really tough as it is.


Thank you! All I read is that burning means nerve damage and with facial nerve damage diagnosed by neurologist I assumed I also must have lingual nerve damage (no taste there either)
As for numbness its quite ok. Id say i have about 60-70% back and theres no milimeter of my face where i wouldn feel when touching. It still feels stiff (mouth and chin area) but getting slowly better each week.
My left cheek os also tingly but i giess thats good.
The biggest issue is that i cannot chee properly (without openong mouth) I lisp and i cant taste food lile before as well as the crooked lips when speaking. I have friends doing shifts with me here and Id never do this to my parents so these are just thoughts... I just feel good only when sleeping. Thank you very much for replying. Its so helpful emotionally to be able to speak w someone who inderstands.

snapdresser
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Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 7:31 am

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#7 Postby snapdresser » Mon Mar 27, 2017 12:00 pm

That's good to hear that you have some feeling everywhere! :D The nerves take the longest to recover. That tingling in your cheek is good. I had tingling in one cheek that took over a year to return to normal :roll: That's good that the stiffness in your mouth and chin is slowly getting better too :) The mental aspects are tricky, but that's good that you have some friends around!
No braces
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devastated
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:40 pm

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#8 Postby devastated » Mon Mar 27, 2017 12:43 pm

snapdresser wrote:That's good to hear that you have some feeling everywhere! :D The nerves take the longest to recover. That tingling in your cheek is good. I had tingling in one cheek that took over a year to return to normal :roll: That's good that the stiffness in your mouth and chin is slowly getting better too :) The mental aspects are tricky, but that's good that you have some friends around!


Seems like for me these nerves are healing fast. Unfortunatelly those that are responsible for mouth movement - dont. My friends are winderful. You def need them if you go threw this surgery. I suppose regardless of the results. Thank you again.

BlondeCam
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Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#9 Postby BlondeCam » Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:13 pm

The only thing I have to offer are my thoughts and prayers. So sorry. I would def try to get to your doc for some help with the depression. Again, so sorry you are going through this.

devastated
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:40 pm

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#10 Postby devastated » Tue Mar 28, 2017 3:10 pm

BlondeCam wrote:The only thing I have to offer are my thoughts and prayers. So sorry. I would def try to get to your doc for some help with the depression. Again, so sorry you are going through this.


Thank you thats very kind

Metalmouth33
Posts: 25
Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2017 10:53 am

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#11 Postby Metalmouth33 » Tue Mar 28, 2017 8:18 pm

I know how you feel. Sleep is a real asset. I had surgery 5 years ago ( I can't believe it's been that long ) and I still have a burning feeling in my mouth. It comes and goes, and honestly it sounds to be much less severe than yours, but on a bad day it is absolutely debilitating. If i were to scale it 1 to 10, it usually sits at 1, but sometimes it flares up to 4 or 5. It has not gotten any better or worse for me. It says the same. It really sucks when it flares up. I wish I knew why it did that. Try some weed if the pain is too much. Marijuana really does soothe the nervous system. Don't smoke as you are still recovering from surgery, but try some edibles, or some oil. You can eat a brownie, or put a drop of oil under your tongue and you'll feel relief for most of the day. It helps me alot on bad days anyways,. The type of weed is important. Some weed makes your body feel numb ( good for nerve pain). Some weed is more psychedelic ( also good, but not the trait you're looking for ) . You must also take sparingly while you are recovering, if at all. Weed slows down my immune system, so maybe other systems required for the long-term healing are affected as well, but that only happens when you take it consistently over a period of time. I can say for sure that it does lessen my nerve pain, but I won't lie and say it erases all feeling. A few months ago I was drunk/high on weed/ high on mushrooms ( I don't go past weed, and only mushrooms on special occasions, have done maybe 6 times in my life). I remember that night, there really was no pain at all, and the difference it makes for you is phenomenal. It's so easy to feel happy about life when you don't feel pain. Today I am feeling okay, today I feel happy. Two days ago it wasn't so good, and I was almost in tears the entire day.

Did your surgeon duly inform you of the risks of nerve damage?

After some research I am finding that my surgeon was grossly negligent in his treatment of me. Like you, I wanted a surgery for aesthetic reasons. I had malocclusion and some crooked teeth, but I had no functional problems whatsoever. I didn't have any TMJ problems. I didn't have any problems chewing/breathing (I am a mouth breather while I sleep, but this didn't change post surgery, and it wasn't something I talked to the surgeon about). Now post surgery, I have TMJ symptoms, nerve damage, and the aesthetics are left to be wanting.

The surgeons actions were an attack against my god given rights. There was no explanation of the aesthetic changes that could be expected from my surgery until AFTER the surgery. Even so, these talks were uninformative and minimal, and did not come from the surgeon himself, they came from my ortho. This was an attack against my right to liberty. Through his negligence, the surgeon made a choice for me regarding my aesthetics. Recently I was able to find plenty of before & after pictures / testimonials online which were 100x more explanatory about the results/risks of the surgery than my surgeon was. Not once was I shown a lifelike result of this surgery, not even AFTER the surgery. Because of this action, my right to life, and my right to security of person have been comprised. The quality of my life has been forever changed. See the above physical symptoms. And I have also been the recipient of undue stress. Post-surgery I experienced severe depression and social anxiety, and still contend with this to this day. All of this has stripped me of my dignity, ALL of this is due to the fault of the surgeon.

Would I have made a different choice had I been properly informed? Maybe, or maybe not, if the surgeon had properly informed me then he would not be at fault, but that doesn't matter. What's done is done. I should have done more research myself, but the nature of services rendered still lays blame on the surgeon. He is a professional, and a scientific professional at that. His understanding of the subject matter is vastly beyond mine and is vastly beyond what you can reasonably expect a non-professional to have. He has a duty to act prudently. He is obligated to do his best to let his patients know what they are getting into. Me and the surgeon had made contracts together, but because of his negligence all those contracts are null. By law, he must return everything to it's former. But how can he give me my old painless body and aesthetics back? He cannot. It is impossible. Now listen carefully, the ONLY recompense he can give you is Money. More treatments/procedures don't count. Finding a fix for a burden does not justify the burden in the first place. That means you must sue. If you are going to sue a surgeon for an injury you typically have 2 years to do so (could be more or less time, depending on where you live). In my case I may still be able to sue, but that is only if I could argue that my case is an exception. You have 2 years to sue for an injury after you become 'aware' of the injury. You are already aware, so for you the clock is ticking. Some of my injuries I have been aware of for more than two years, but the first injury which started it all was the surgeon making a choice for me regarding my aesthetics, and then carrying out that choice of his. I was not aware of this injury until yesterday.

It's a risk to sue though. If you lose it will cost you alot of money on top of the time invested. I have no assets to lose, no family to support, and all the time in the world. But honestly, it probably wouldn't be worth it. The amount of money the surgeon/hospital/government should collectively owe me is 100 million dollars. Not because 100 million dollars is fair compensation to someone whose mouth hurts and doesn't like their facial changes, but because 100 million dollars on a single case might sting the system enough to at least guarantee a standard of care and prudence for all patients. We experience the entirety of our lives through our bodies. Our bodies are invaluable. Any injustice against this is immeasurable and unacceptable.

That's my case, anyways,

Did you surgeon duly inform you of the risks of nerve damage?

devastated
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:40 pm

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#12 Postby devastated » Tue Mar 28, 2017 10:53 pm

Metalmouth33 wrote:I know how you feel. Sleep is a real asset. I had surgery 5 years ago ( I can't believe it's been that long ) and I still have a burning feeling in my mouth. It comes and goes, and honestly it sounds to be much less severe than yours, but on a bad day it is absolutely debilitating. If i were to scale it 1 to 10, it usually sits at 1, but sometimes it flares up to 4 or 5. It has not gotten any better or worse for me. It says the same. It really sucks when it flares up. I wish I knew why it did that. Try some weed if the pain is too much. Marijuana really does soothe the nervous system. Don't smoke as you are still recovering from surgery, but try some edibles, or some oil. You can eat a brownie, or put a drop of oil under your tongue and you'll feel relief for most of the day. It helps me alot on bad days anyways,. The type of weed is important. Some weed makes your body feel numb ( good for nerve pain). Some weed is more psychedelic ( also good, but not the trait you're looking for ) . You must also take sparingly while you are recovering, if at all. Weed slows down my immune system, so maybe other systems required for the long-term healing are affected as well, but that only happens when you take it consistently over a period of time. I can say for sure that it does lessen my nerve pain, but I won't lie and say it erases all feeling. A few months ago I was drunk/high on weed/ high on mushrooms ( I don't go past weed, and only mushrooms on special occasions, have done maybe 6 times in my life). I remember that night, there really was no pain at all, and the difference it makes for you is phenomenal. It's so easy to feel happy about life when you don't feel pain. Today I am feeling okay, today I feel happy. Two days ago it wasn't so good, and I was almost in tears the entire day.

Did your surgeon duly inform you of the risks of nerve damage?

After some research I am finding that my surgeon was grossly negligent in his treatment of me. Like you, I wanted a surgery for aesthetic reasons. I had malocclusion and some crooked teeth, but I had no functional problems whatsoever. I didn't have any TMJ problems. I didn't have any problems chewing/breathing (I am a mouth breather while I sleep, but this didn't change post surgery, and it wasn't something I talked to the surgeon about). Now post surgery, I have TMJ symptoms, nerve damage, and the aesthetics are left to be wanting.

The surgeons actions were an attack against my god given rights. There was no explanation of the aesthetic changes that could be expected from my surgery until AFTER the surgery. Even so, these talks were uninformative and minimal, and did not come from the surgeon himself, they came from my ortho. This was an attack against my right to liberty. Through his negligence, the surgeon made a choice for me regarding my aesthetics. Recently I was able to find plenty of before & after pictures / testimonials online which were 100x more explanatory about the results/risks of the surgery than my surgeon was. Not once was I shown a lifelike result of this surgery, not even AFTER the surgery. Because of this action, my right to life, and my right to security of person have been comprised. The quality of my life has been forever changed. See the above physical symptoms. And I have also been the recipient of undue stress. Post-surgery I experienced severe depression and social anxiety, and still contend with this to this day. All of this has stripped me of my dignity, ALL of this is due to the fault of the surgeon.

Would I have made a different choice had I been properly informed? Maybe, or maybe not, if the surgeon had properly informed me then he would not be at fault, but that doesn't matter. What's done is done. I should have done more research myself, but the nature of services rendered still lays blame on the surgeon. He is a professional, and a scientific professional at that. His understanding of the subject matter is vastly beyond mine and is vastly beyond what you can reasonably expect a non-professional to have. He has a duty to act prudently. He is obligated to do his best to let his patients know what they are getting into. Me and the surgeon had made contracts together, but because of his negligence all those contracts are null. By law, he must return everything to it's former. But how can he give me my old painless body and aesthetics back? He cannot. It is impossible. Now listen carefully, the ONLY recompense he can give you is Money. More treatments/procedures don't count. Finding a fix for a burden does not justify the burden in the first place. That means you must sue. If you are going to sue a surgeon for an injury you typically have 2 years to do so (could be more or less time, depending on where you live). In my case I may still be able to sue, but that is only if I could argue that my case is an exception. You have 2 years to sue for an injury after you become 'aware' of the injury. You are already aware, so for you the clock is ticking. Some of my injuries I have been aware of for more than two years, but the first injury which started it all was the surgeon making a choice for me regarding my aesthetics, and then carrying out that choice of his. I was not aware of this injury until yesterday.

It's a risk to sue though. If you lose it will cost you alot of money on top of the time invested. I have no assets to lose, no family to support, and all the time in the world. But honestly, it probably wouldn't be worth it. The amount of money the surgeon/hospital/government should collectively owe me is 100 million dollars. Not because 100 million dollars is fair compensation to someone whose mouth hurts and doesn't like their facial changes, but because 100 million dollars on a single case might sting the system enough to at least guarantee a standard of care and prudence for all patients. We experience the entirety of our lives through our bodies. Our bodies are invaluable. Any injustice against this is immeasurable and unacceptable.

That's my case, anyways,

Did you surgeon duly inform you of the risks of nerve damage?


So sorry to read all this. ;(
Youre right about everything.
I feel my life is over.
I have not been informed about possibility of facial nerve damage
I have no strenghts to sue , I cant get out of bed.

Metalmouth33
Posts: 25
Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2017 10:53 am

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#13 Postby Metalmouth33 » Wed Mar 29, 2017 12:40 pm

The hard part is proving all this in court with evidence. Keep records of everything if you think you would sue one day. You don't have to prove 100%, you just have to prove that your case is the most likely, and that may be enough to hold up in court.

Thank you for your sympathy, but you need it more than I do. I did not lose any of the motor functions of my mouth or face, it has pain, but I can still do everything. In the meantime your health is your #1 priority right now. You need to do as much as possible during your recovery to regain what you lost. You'll have time to sue later if that is what you decide.

Just think of my mom anytime you're in trouble. She broke her hip once and because of a misdiagnosis she was sent home w/o treatment for a few days. It was a minuscule fracture that led to some blood loss around the bone, which ended up in the bone dying 10 years down the road. It took her years before she could walk normally again, then her bone died and she had to have hip replacement surgery and do it all again (the recovery from hip replacement surgery was 3x as fast, luckily). All throughout the process she never lost focus of her health, and she had a fantastic attitude towards her life! She still went on vacations. She worked on herself, always, and guess what she can walk perfectly fine today. She always makes jokes about that period in her life. I'm sure you can imagine her hardship, and she endured so so can you.

devastated
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:40 pm

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#14 Postby devastated » Wed Mar 29, 2017 3:36 pm

Metalmouth33 wrote:The hard part is proving all this in court with evidence. Keep records of everything if you think you would sue one day. You don't have to prove 100%, you just have to prove that your case is the most likely, and that may be enough to hold up in court.

Thank you for your sympathy, but you need it more than I do. I did not lose any of the motor functions of my mouth or face, it has pain, but I can still do everything. In the meantime your health is your #1 priority right now. You need to do as much as possible during your recovery to regain what you lost. You'll have time to sue later if that is what you decide.

Just think of my mom anytime you're in trouble. She broke her hip once and because of a misdiagnosis she was sent home w/o treatment for a few days. It was a minuscule fracture that led to some blood loss around the bone, which ended up in the bone dying 10 years down the road. It took her years before she could walk normally again, then her bone died and she had to have hip replacement surgery and do it all again (the recovery from hip replacement surgery was 3x as fast, luckily). All throughout the process she never lost focus of her health, and she had a fantastic attitude towards her life! She still went on vacations. She worked on herself, always, and guess what she can walk perfectly fine today. She always makes jokes about that period in her life. I'm sure you can imagine her hardship, and she endured so so can you.



Kudos to your mum!
Thank you for your encouragement and sympathy.
I'll update when I know sth.
Just got info from my neurologist we shall check if theres no co-existing conditions (like tumor) which just got "activated" after jaw surgery and causing the nerve symptoms as my surgeon is 100% certain it is not due to osteotomy..

Metalmouth33
Posts: 25
Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2017 10:53 am

Re: Terrible results and nerve damage

#15 Postby Metalmouth33 » Thu Mar 30, 2017 3:14 am

I'm not an expert by any means, but that makes no sense to me whatsoever. You had the surgery and then these things showed up. It seems there's almost 100% chance that the surgery was the cause. And he says he's 100% sure it wasn't? Weird.


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